Hi All,

The comments on my post, "IM, why?" got so long (thankfully!) that I decided to address the many excellent comments and thinking points in a new post instead of writing a comment longer than the original post.

Thanks to this discussion, I can fairly clearly see that I should be IMing, or at least giving it a better try than I’ve been able to the last few days.  That is good, but it has come from one-on-one discussion.  I tossed something out there as to why I think many don’t IM and many of you have responded, and in those individual responses, and collectively, reside some reasons—personal reasons for me—why I should be using IM.

I still have concerns with IM’s possible impact as a distractor in my life.  I know me and I know what my "workload" is like right now.  Only I can judge whether or not it becomes an operative distractor.  But that is the key, which many of you helped realize, I cannot decide if it has become a distractor until I give it a chance.

As task-oriented as I can be, I still get distracted very easily, and often welcome distraction when I shouldn’t.  I was one of the early Ritalin kids of America; maybe still should be.  But that is a completely different topic.

I want to keep this as positive as possible, because despite what or how things were said, there was something positive for me in everyone’s comments.  But to foreshadow more comments on the topic, we need to be very careful about dismissing people’s personal experience.  I tried to make clear that my comments in my post were based on my experiences, or lack thereof.  I did make at least one generalization, and that is certainly open to "attack."  But to dismiss someone’s personal experiences out-of-hand is not a good tactic and, in fact, in my opinion may often even be immoral.  Challenge my views of my experiences, or offer other experiences to show me a different form of experience, which is what many of you did, and I’ll see your point a lot faster, whether or not I accept it in whole or in part, than if my experiences have been dismissed.  It’s great that your experience is different than mine, but I could do the same thing and just dismiss your experience.  Then we are just arguing, and to no good end.

Now, I know I’m pretty weird, but I like having my views and interpretations of my experiences challenged.  I like being shown, as much as possible, a world that I have no, and in some ways cannot have, experience of.  Many people, though, want absolutely none of that.  So whatever has "worked" here with/for me, we need to be careful about extrapolating that to others.

One more even bigger gripe—and I am clearly not saying that anyone has crossed this line—that I have and others may also have, or they may have other hot button issues, is questioning my service ethic.  Unless someone has knowledge of a specific incident, please, please do not ever publicly question my service ethic, my commitment to my patrons, or whatever you want to label it as.  If you want to suggest that some statement or act, or lack of, of mine may not have the best impact on my patrons, or that maybe I could rethink how said might impact my patrons, and so on, that is perfectly acceptable.  That needs to be done on occasion, and we all need a reminder to think of others once in a while. 

There was a comment that came close and had me clearly upset for a bit, even as I saw much of value in the comment.  Once I gave it a few minutes, I realized that I did not believe that the intent was to question if I actually had a service ethic, but was to get me to think about my beliefs in the second way, and that’s cool as I said.

But I have been serving for going on 30 years now.  I have given up much over the years to do so—opportunity for a "better" life as measured by mainstream American thought, mental health, physical health, comfort, and many other things, both tangible and intangible.  And believe me, I am not simply referring to my time in the military.  I am also, most certainly, referring to my 6 years in an academic library, and even to my 2 years in library school. 

Trying to take the best possible care of my patrons, despite the many roadblocks thrown up by the administration, had me on the edge of suicide repeatedly, had me on powerful mind-fucking drugs that I would never wish on anyone, had me in counseling.  Doing my best for my patrons has caused me to be in the worst physical, mentaland emotional health of my 45+ years.  So, please do not ever question my commitment to my patrons, or my service ethic; at least not if you are actually trying to have a dialogue or even just change my opinion.  If you want to get me out of the conversation completely, or goad me into saying something stupid that I’ll regret later, or just really, really piss me off, well, I guess I just told you how.

Again, I freely admit that my service skills, and even attitude on occasion, can be improved.  But I don’t think that my service ethic could be strengthened in any way.

Whew!  Glad that’s out of the way.  Many of you did my heart wonders by offering to chat, converse, and just say "Hi" via IM.  I truly mean that!  I don’t know if it’s age, generational, mission-focus, or what, but as many of you that are out there that I would love to chat with I’m not the kind of person (or haven’t been anyway) that is just going to pop in to say "Hi," as much as I might like to.  Knowing that you are welcoming goes a long way to helping me past that hurdle.

I think, too, that maybe in one way it’s sort of like when you see someone out in public that you’d like to say "Hi" to, but don’t for various reasons.  I saw someone at the theater last night and wanted to say "Hi," but didn’t.  And this isn’t the first time I did not with this person, although this was possibly my best "chance." 

"Hi, Xxxxx, I just love your playful banter with xxxx on WXXX on Xxxxxday xxxnings."  Or, "Hi, are you Xxxxx Xxxxxx..? (when I full well know that she is) I love you on the radio with Xxxx…"
 
"Go away dork."  "What a perv!"  "I can’t go anywhere in public without some weirdo harassing me."  Maybe not likely responses, or so I’d hope, but these things keep us from approaching people all the time.  And I don’t see online as any different in this regard.  Plus, I have no doubt that we are all busy people, and I don’t want to be an imposition.  Now, many of you may be thinking that this is silly, and you have even shown me that in your individual cases it may be, but it is still my belief, my ethic, and the way in which I experience portions of my life.  I would hope that you wouldn’t dismiss that.

OK, I think we can move on to your comments now.  [Administrative note:  I am linking commentor's names to their comments since I am excerpting.  If you desire to find or go to their own blogs you should click the links to their comments and then click on their linked name in their comment.  Those should go to their blogs in all cases I believe.]

Jenny:  "Sometimes I see something cool, or end up making last minute plans and it comes down to how long would it take to get ahold of someone. if they are right there on IM, they’ll get the info. If they aren’t they won’t."  Also, sees as non-intrusive and serves various purposes in her life.

That does make sense to me.  Maybe my own view of my coolness, or lack thereof, is all in my head.  Maybe if I routinely used IM I would end up seeming cooler to myself since I would (possibly) hear about more spur-of-the-moment things.  I am trying to be more spontaneous in my life—the Army bred a lot of that out of me—so it seems to be a very good reason to try IM. 

As for not being a distraction, I can appreciate that.  It just seems to me that in my life it could be.  I have also heard from another serious IM user that it can be, and that he sometimes needs to turn it off to get important work done.  Seems fair, and as I said above, I won’t know until I try.

As for fulfilling various purposes, I agree that those are useful purposes and may well become so for me.  But until now, I have been able to either fulfill them in other ways or delay the fulfillment until they could be accomplished in another way.  Again, just my personal experience to date, not that it can’t be changed.

Greg:  "…your lack of IM presence strikes me as a missed opportunity for dialogue."

Point taken.

"I completely disagree that email makes a suitable substitute for synchronous chat. Email conversations are like playing phone tag and leaving alternating voicemails." 

So do I, on occasion.  I wasn’t claiming that it is perfect as a synchronous means of conversation.  But your comment reflects your experience, and even mine on occasion but, generally my experience has been different.  Sometimes, though, emails don’t come through quickly.  So, point taken as this was a bit of a stretch, although it has been working out for me lately.

"If you prefer real conversation, then we should be talking about having you experiment with VoIP technologies. I’ll be happy to Skype you with my comments when you’re ready."

Well, I think that is a good idea, but I hope I won’t have to wait that long for your comments.  Skype sounds like a good project for me once I get a "break" later this summer.

Let’s all remember that learning one of these new tools takes time, and that some are faster at it than others.  Not to claim that I am any busier than anyone else, but I am currently very busy trying to finish up this semester.  I really don’t want my grades to go to crap in my last semester.  The things I am learning are important to me, and I am pushing and challenging myself far further than the school or my instructors require of me.  Besides my work and educational ethic, I need and want to do an excellent job on my serials cataloging exercises because very shortly I may be asking this instructor for a job, or at a minimum to put in a good word for me.  And so on….  Again, we are all busy; my point is that we can’t just get a screen name and then automagically know how to use IM, what its capabilities are, what its affordances are, etc.  We need time to practice, use, and learn them.  And I thank you all for giving me a definite boost, if not exactly in seeing those, at least in imagining them.

"Look, your (eventual) patrons are using IM. The critical mass is there. Granted, the demographic skews young, but today’s young are tomorrow’s old. It’s reason enough for you to "just go for it" TODAY (and it seems like you are, begrudgingly) and stop putting up these narcissistic barriers about fulfilling personal needs. That’s so much BS, Mark! Librarians shouldn’t require more motivation than the need to understand our patrons. Librarianship is not about you, but I don’t really need to tell you that, do I?"

Point taken, mostly.  I’ll take the demographic point, for me, first, although it may impact others differently, even if not justifiably.  Me, I don’t care about the demographic.  The vast majority of my friends and acquaintances are the age of my own children, or at best 5 years older.  Many of you fall in that range, or a tad bit over.  This has been the case for 7+ years now, and even if I sometimes wish for more friends or acquaintances closer to my age, I most certainly do not wish for less who are younger than me.  I get so much of value from knowing these people.  So for me anyway, the demographic is a definite non-issue in my use of IM or any other technology.

And maybe I am doing it begrudgingly, so what?  As much as I like to challenge my views and change my life, that doesn’t make the actual doing any easier.  I can certainly tell you that I very begrudgingly took over e-reserves in my last job, but that had no impact on how much of myself I put into the task.  I had a specific patron base and their needs took precedence over my desires.

No, Greg, librarianship is not about me.  But none of us should have to be martyrs—and having been one, I don’t intend to ever again—and none of us should have to leap past our personal comfort zones.  Should we be required to push at them?  Most certainly!  And for me, right now, IM is only a small push.  But for many it is a leap.  That is not to justify obstinacy, or to dismiss one’s patrons needs, but let’s talk about this "need" of our patrons for a bit.

Many of you, and others elsewhere, have said something along the lines of "This is where your patrons are."  True enough, for me and my eventual patrons.  Probably true for many of you; certainly those saying it.  But it is not universally true.  All of these various studies, Pew and otherwise are flawed.  How much; I don’t know.  If I did, I’d be a demographer and statistician.  But they are highly skewed towards the urban and suburban, and to the lower middle-class and above.  In most instances, one must have a phone before they can be surveyed.  Many people in America do not have phones.  And if you don’t have a phone, I doubt that you are using IM.  Even if the children in these families attend schools with computers (questionable for many), the school computers probably do not allow IM.  Should it be that way?  Maybe not.  But the fact is, just because most of us lead, in some ways, "privileged" lives does not mean that everyone else does, even in America.  Do I need to remind any of you just how much Hurricane Katrina showed us how invisible the poor are in America?  Or that for most Americans the poor have gone back to being invisible just as quickly as any other "news story" that is no longer on the front page?

The world is not freaking "flat" and it never will be be for the vast majority of human beings who live on it.  Friedman and his screwed up view is just as dangerous as any other form of social Darwinism!  He has a point, but it only applies to some.  Is the number of "privileged" peoples growing world-wide?  Quite possibly.  But the whole concept is completely unsustainable on a global-scale.  We simply cannot reproduce the West’s standard of living to the whole world and, in fact, even if we weren’t trying and hoarded it all for ourselves it still isn’t sustainable.

But back to ourselves and librarianship.  Again, no, librarianship is not about me in the most important sense.  But then if I did not find service rewarding, if I did not find librarianship intellectually challenging and emotionally fulfilling, if I didn’t like some of the people who comprise the work environment then I would certainly find another calling.  So it is, somewhat, about me.  Just as it is somewhat about you, all of you.  You do it for your own reasons, which just might be my reasons, too.  If I have to be a slave to whoever my patrons are, if I can’t consider my own needs in life, if I have to be a complete martyr to those I willingly serve, please, let me know now because I can do lots of other things in life.  And once I have to do that (again), I’m heading someplace else.  It might be a healthier department or library, and if I can’t find one I’ll find a job in another field.  And no, I do not consider being a librarian just a job, but it is almost never life-and-death and I will not again make a long-term sacrifice of my mental, emotional or physical health to serve my beloved patrons.  They deserve better!

So, Greg, I do agree with you in spirit, at least.  And I have no doubt that if we could actually sit over a pint or two that we’d be saying exactly the same thing.  I look forward to it.  Thank you for your comments; I found them very valuable!

T. Scott:  Thank you for your comments and reflection on your prior experiences.  I even said in my initial post that I’d probably take right to it once I actually dove in. 

And I seriously wish I had more time right now to do that diving, but school work, planning for my daughter’s college graduation and my own, updating my resume, writing a cover letter, verifying references, planning a job search strategy, trying not to think about what is required to move this summer, learning serials cataloging, learning MODS and DC and how to encode bib citations in these schemas, how to crosswalk from MODS to DC without losing vast amounts of information, how to put all this together into an OAI-PMH compatible static repository page and how to validate and use said repository, write an indexing standard, blah, blah, all competes for the time that I could be talking to you all via IM.

And I do want to talk to you all!  So many of you have left messages along the lines of, "Well, if you were online right now…."  I am sorry!  I truly am.  But despite all of the above, I am on a high right now school-wise and I’d like to keep that for a few more weeks.  My final semester of undergrad (2001) ended horribly.  And that my friends, is a complete understatement.  This semester started out heading that way and it was freaking me out to no end.  Let’s simply say I was making sure I had the crisis line’s number in my wallet again.  I undertook a few small adjustments and have completely recovered course.  I am soaring on the winds of all that I find personally rewarding about academia; please give me time to end this semester the way I need to. 

I do feel bad about not being available for these conversations right now, and I am aware that they might not be in the future.  I only hope that there might be others.  Nothing seems to be ethically simple for me, and now my decision to try IM seems to have landed me in an ethical quagmire again.  I am not blaming this on any of you!  It is just that now knowing that people want to talk to me, I feel the ethical need to facilitate that.  But I must also look out for my own needs; one of which is to talk with you.  It is oh so complicated.

And thanks, T. Scott, for pointing out that folks over 40 are using IM.

Jenica:  Thanks for the very utilitarian examples of use and need.  I certainly agree that most college and university libraries should be supporting and encouraging the use of IM.  While not every college student uses IM, I’d agree that these are the people that Pew and others are reporting on.  I also see the beauty of it for internal communication, just as T. Scott pointed out.

"But I still hark back to "our users love it, so we need to understand it" as the most compelling reason for trying it." 

I fully agree!  When your patrons are using it, as most of ours probably are.  My point, and I don’t mean it as a justification to dismiss the thought of using IM out-of-hand, is that this is not a universal truth, although it is probably pretty close for all of us.

Angel:  I get your point, and I’m pretty sure Greg does, too.  He has apologized to both of us, and even cited some of your writing in trying to clarify his thoughts.  It seems to me that he values your thoughts, and mine; otherwise, why would he be working at having a conversation?  Greg is certainly no troll and I value his opinion, and dissent.

I certainly do not mean to psychoanalyze Greg, but there’s been some real weirdness in the biblioblogosphere of late.  I’ve even been a party to some of it myself.  I could link to some of it, but I see no need to point out some of my more embarrassing examples of behavior at this point, although I often do (point them out, hopefully not have them).  Anyway, this medium certainly does not make for the most nuanced discussion.  Greg could have very easily used those exact same words in person or quite possibly even on the phone and they would not seem the same, because they aren’t.  There are far more cues to get information from in either of those venues, cues that are completely lacking in print.  He did what he could at the time, and even tried several times before hitting post, and I am giving him credit for that. 

I should be the last one for faulting someone for having strong views, and having trouble articulating them.  That, is the story of my life.  But if someone is trying, then I’m willing to try too.

Andrea:  "While I find blog comment discussions to be really cool, I find them to be a bit too passive and scattered for really figuring something out (especially when there are related comments and blog posts floating all over the ‘sphere), so I prefer direct communication, which IM affords."

Yes, I do agree.  Sometimes they work well, but they have their limits.  That is why I often refer to blogosphere conversation as "conversation." 

"If you weren’t free, I’d be able to figure out a time later, and the mode of communication most amenable to you. And between the phone, IM, and email, we have a pretty decent set of options."

Definitely!  Part of the problem, and it goes back to my ethical concerns, is I don’t yet know how IM works, as in the various bells and whistles.  I imagine I can figure out how to set an away message, just as I changed my "icon."  But I don’t know how it all ties together, as in, can I just leave the client open but somehow mark myself as away.  If I do, or even forget to, does it act sort of like an answering machine and record that someone tried to contact me, and if so how much does it record?  These are all probably simple things to learn and are probably in the links Michael Stephens and others posted to my first post, but I haven’t had a chance to check them out, as much as I might like to.  Yes, I’m feeling bad here that I started this conversation and haven’t entered it whole heartedly, but please see some of the above comments.  I want and need to be beaming on graduation day.  The opposite is a distinct possibility in my life, it already has been once, and I will do almost anything to prevent a recurrence.

"In the three years I’ve been attending library conferences, just about every conference offers at least one program on using IM in the library as if it’s this new thing. These programs generally cover what IM is, how patrons use it, and why librarians should care." 

I do agree that much has been offered by caring and giving librarians to their peers, but I go back to my "if they don’t currently see a need they’re probably not going to attend;" just as I didn’t attend any of these.  We could trot out the, "It’s about the patrons, silly," and that would probably be fair, but the situation is often more complex than that.  How many of us have wanted to do things to aid our patrons, but weren’t allowed to, either because Systems didn’t allow it, management didn’t, or resources did not?  Probably all of us. 

So let’s say we have a librarian who realizes that her patrons are on IM, and that she needs to be there too.  But she’s in a library where IM is explicitly locked out by the Systems folks and that the administration has made it abundantly clear that it will stay that way, for whatever reasons.  Is this librarian going to spend valuable conference time attending a session that she earnestly believes that she needs to, but that she also knows will have no real payoff since she will not be able to use what she learns?  Again, I’m doubting it.  And I could be wrong, but I maintain that these people exist.

"Looking back on my post, it’s weird because I’m more of a "figure out what you need, then apply the tool to the job" person, not a "just install it and use it and figure it out later" person."

Yes, I fully agree, at least I get that from your posts generally.  Maybe that’s what struck me in the first place, it didnt "seem" like you.

Laura:  Thanks for the comments, for pointing out some of the utilitarian uses of IM, and especially for the invite to just pop in and say "Hi!"  I’ll certainly take you up on it as soon as I can.

Greg redux:  You’re cool with me, brother.  Because although I may disagree about whether or not, or more likely the extent to which, I am/was putting up barriers there is certainly truth and value in your words.  And some are guilty of what you say, maybe even me at some level.  Maybe I didn’t express myself well enough; that would certainly not be a first in my life.  All I can say is I am actively striving to be better at it, while knowing full well that no matter what, I (we all) am doomed to fail at it in some circumstances and situations.

And just for the record, not to say Greg was claiming differently, I have been profusely experimenting with these sorts of tools, before, but especially since coming to library school.  I have learned to use wikis, and do use several, to include having a pseudo-wiki on my laptop.  I worked my first year in GSLIS’ User Services and my patron base was everyone worldwide who is affiliated with GSLIS and their computer problems, of any stripe, on any platform.  I had to learn all sorts of new, and sometimes exciting, things.  I’ve taught myself CSS.  I’m now learning XML and its affiliated technologies and implementing it.  Part of my initial patron base and currently my entire patron base is the highly exclusive group constituting the students, instructors and professors who make up our distance education program, LEEP.  I have used an IRC-based chat room to talk people through reinstalling Java and RealPlayer on their machines.  I have placed conference calls for guest speakers and student presentations.  And so on.  Heck, one of the reasons I bought a PowerBook was because I was tired of not being able to help my patrons with Macs, and we have a very significant base of Mac users.  Based on server logs of browsers used, which is slightly skewed because of ambiguity of some browsers reporting themselves, we have about a 30% Mac user base in LEEP.  Now that certainly isn’t the only reason I chose Mac, but it had a profound impact on my decision.  It could at least be said to have offset the needing new software aspect.  I know many librarians sit on their butts regarding learning new tools, but I doubt that I can honestly be accused of that.

Oh, Greg, please feel welcome to post comments here!  I, full well, know the experience of drafting and redrafting a comment, jsut to give it up on occasion.  Sometimes giving it up is best, but not always.

Andrea redux:  "No worries, Mark. I’m a librarian, silly! Questions are desireable, not to mention being the basis of learning and democratic thinking and, well, what I love to do for a living." 

That’s good to hear.  But, honestly, my feelings on the matter is that that view isn’t near as widespread as it should be in our profession.  I’ve seen it firsthand in an academic library, I’ve seen it in library school, and I’ve definitely seen it in the biblioblogosphere.  Most of us want our patrons to ask questions, within various limits but, yes, patrons should ask questions.  And while some of us want our peers to ask questions and we hope to be able to ask them questions, it isn’t as true as it should be. 

And, no, I will not name any names.  So, if you want to consider this a straw-man argument, please feel free.  It may only be my perception, but I can guarantee you that it is, sometimes, the case.  I have scores of folks who would back me up on this in all of the above mentioned venues—a specific library, amongst others, my library school, and others, and out here where we are all having a decent discussion.

I might discuss some of this via IM or other more personal means, but only if I have your assurances that it is private conversation.

"However, I don’t get the part where you say "to represent what I see as a wider trend among some". Can you help me understand that?"

I will try, although some of it may have to wait for private discussion.  Unfortunately, it falls under my, and I know a few others’, perceptions of some of what we see in the biblioblogosphere and even some formally published literature in our, and affiliated, fields.  If I had the time, and inclination, I could certainly find examples.  Now you and others might disagree with my interpretation and perception, that’s fair.  I guess what I’m trying to say without naming names is that it seems as if many people are saying, "Just do it, it’s for the patrons stupid," and similar sounding things.  Many of us feel preached to, we feel degraded, we feel belittled.  We do not feel as if it is a conversation, or as if we are being engaged as equals who may need to actually be encouraged (in various ways) so that we may change our views or actions.  I feel as if many are making this (IM adoption) among many other things a simple black-and-white affair.  We either get it, which makes us a "cool kid," or we don’t, which makes us a neo-Luddite, obstinate, or perhaps even narcissistic.  Now I know that was said in a moment of frustration, and I’m OK with that, but it points to a certain (and perhaps sometimes justifiable) feeling that is out there.  My point is that nothing is that simple and that, while some may deserve to be treated in this manner, many of us deserve better.  Heck, all of us deserve better, even the obstinate ones.  The point is that preaching and name-calling, intentionally or not, probably is not a good way to reach people.  And I was not associating Andrea or anyone else here with that view.

Many people are doing great things to encourage us to experiment, to try, and perhaps even to better ourselves or, at least, broaden our horizons.  I am extremely grateful to these folks.  But as I said above, there are people who could not agree more who simply cannot invest the time and energy to learn a valuable tool that they won’t be able to utilize in their situation.

It may be a long hard road, and I have no doubt that it is frustrating as I experience similar things in my life all of the time, but that is no excuse for not continuing to try to reach people.  If one decides that their message is important then, in my humble opinion, they have an ethical duty to try and  communicate that to people.  This may require multiple ways, it may take longer than they like, and they are free to give up on the (self-appointed) mission.  But they are not, again IMHO, free to belittle or call others names because they don’t immediately get the "Word" from on high.  Again, I am not accusing anyone here of that.  And maybe you don’t see it in others, either locally or  in the literature or in the biblioblogosphere, but either you are not reading the same things some of us are, or if you are we’d say that you are deceiving yourself.  Now that is certainly a matter of opinion and interpretation, but we are as entitled to ours as anyone else is.

Angel redux:  Keep your head up, brother!  Your course may be wisest in the short- and long-run.  Unfortunately for me, this blog ended up replacing my journal.  Either I am not smart or wise enough to not post on occasion, and sometimes I am but I decide to do it anyway.  We’ve discussed the personal issue I have with being silenced.  Even if it is in my best interest, I often cannot be.  And if I could, what sort of librarian would that make me?  The interests of my society and my patrons take priority over matters of personal interest (within reason, of course, as noted above).

And you’ve got to stop talking about keeping things in that journal, Angel!  You’ve got me seriously intrigued; what I wouldn’t give for a peak. 

Kurt (on the initial post):  Thanks for the info, and sorry about missing another opportunity to chat.  Especially since this is one of the folks I’d love to spend more time with, and he’s even local (for now).

Thank you all again!  lease give me a bit of time to bring IM into my life at a pace I can handle under my current situation.

I sincerely look forward to chatting with all of you!

This has taken me almost 3 hours to write, and it is only in a text editor right now—no links, formatting, no serious proofreading, etc.  I’m going to go get lunch and then get this posted.  When I come back from lunch to post this, I’ll launch my IM client and see what happens.  After getting this posted I have homework that must get accomplished and accomplished well, so depending on what happens I may have to become unavailable for a while again.  This is not to discourage anyone from contacting me—I am an adult and have to make the proper use of my own time.